[Sun Jan 25 17:00:24 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Good Evening everyone… Same thing as usual, we’ll start covering a few topics go over them in depth and open it up for any questions that you’re still wondering about the past 2-3 weeks in chat etc etc
[Sun Jan 25 17:00:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive One of the biggest thing’s in chat the past two weeks are the ETFs ( FAS and FAZ ) so we’ll start with that one right out of the gate
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:03 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Please as usual, any questions comments regarding it please PM me
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:09 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and keep it out of the channel
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:20 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and then we’ll open it up like we always do once we have covered everything
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:24 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and you can ask them right in here
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:41 EST 2009] mindstatements hello all
[Sun Jan 25 17:01:53 EST 2009] tortexal Hi everyone! tonight im going to share with you some info that i think is important to know when trading ETFS
[Sun Jan 25 17:02:15 EST 2009] tortexal quick disclaimer i am a bad typer but i’ll do my best ::beer
[Sun Jan 25 17:03:14 EST 2009] tortexal ETFS are very popular right now especially the leveraged ETFS. The reason for this, and especially with instritutional traders and hedge funds, it because it is a lot easier in theory to trade with the general direction of a sector versus try to pick individual stocks
[Sun Jan 25 17:03:30 EST 2009] tortexal especially during extreemly volatile and often unpredictable times like these
[Sun Jan 25 17:04:39 EST 2009] tortexal ETF stands for electronicly traded fund. this is similar to a mutual fund in that it is a esecntially a basket that holds various stocks, and index or both and attempts to mirror their performance
[Sun Jan 25 17:04:56 EST 2009] tortexal the main difference with a mutual fund and an ETF is that and ETF is traded intraday just like a stock
[Sun Jan 25 17:05:00 EST 2009] tortexal where as a mututal fund it not
[Sun Jan 25 17:05:52 EST 2009] tortexal this allow for a great deal of elexability to capture the moves of the underlying sector/stocks/index etc much faster and in some cases with less risk versus a mutual fund that you are stuck with the entire day
[Sun Jan 25 17:06:15 EST 2009] tortexal in an effort to make more money off of intraday movement, leveraged ETFS were created
[Sun Jan 25 17:06:50 EST 2009] tortexal what this mean. is that the fund is using margin to increase its esposure to the underlying assets that it tracks
[Sun Jan 25 17:07:17 EST 2009] tortexal for instance, 2:1 means that if my underlying portfolio is $100, i’ll actually have $200 of market exposure
[Sun Jan 25 17:07:33 EST 2009] tortexal 3:1 mean that my real $100 will have $300 of market exposure
[Sun Jan 25 17:08:21 EST 2009] tortexal on a very basic level, the effect this has is that the moves of the underlying asset that it tracks will be amplified intraday by a factor of 200% for 2:1 or 300% for 3:1
[Sun Jan 25 17:08:31 EST 2009] tortexal now this is good and bad
[Sun Jan 25 17:09:02 EST 2009] tortexal is is good because you can capture movements up to 300% that of the underlying asset…. and make more $$$$$$$$$
[Sun Jan 25 17:09:38 EST 2009] tortexal this is bad bc you can also lose 3x more than what you would have had you been trading the asset at its actualy 1:1 ratio, like how you ttrade stocks
[Sun Jan 25 17:09:49 EST 2009] tortexal and ETFS are ****NOT*** stocks
[Sun Jan 25 17:10:59 EST 2009] tortexal onme thing to add, there are ETFS that follow the direction of the asset (like FAS) and “inverse ETFS” which are a short of the underlying assest (like FAZ)
[Sun Jan 25 17:11:20 EST 2009] tortexal getting back to ETFs not being stocks…
[Sun Jan 25 17:12:15 EST 2009] tortexal since margin is used to capture the movement of the underlying assest in leveraged ETFS, the fund itself is rebalanced every night to make sure that it is maintaining the proper 2:1 or 3:1 ratio of real portfolio money versus market exposure
[Sun Jan 25 17:12:36 EST 2009] tortexal the reason this happens
[Sun Jan 25 17:12:56 EST 2009] tortexal is because the underlying assets are traded seperatly from the ETF, the ETF simply tries to track those assets
[Sun Jan 25 17:13:35 EST 2009] tortexal however, since supply and demand of both the FUND and the underlying assests have nothing to do with each other, there will be many many many discrepencies during the day of the mkt price of the fund and the actual underlying asset value
[Sun Jan 25 17:14:30 EST 2009] tortexal as a a result, every night when the mkt is closed and the dust settles, the fund will look back at the performance of the underlying asset eod (Net asset Value) and compare that with the performance of the fund and its price eod
[Sun Jan 25 17:14:48 EST 2009] tortexal say the NAV lost money
[Sun Jan 25 17:15:13 EST 2009] tortexal that would mean that the underlying portfolio of the fund has also been reduced.
[Sun Jan 25 17:15:25 EST 2009] tortexal however, when leveraged is used, the effect that has on MKT price of the fund is also multipled
[Sun Jan 25 17:15:46 EST 2009] tortexal which will cause a substantial decreade in actual MKT price of the fund for the next day
[Sun Jan 25 17:15:49 EST 2009] tortexal this is a weird concept
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:00 EST 2009] tortexal and hard to visualize w/o pictures!
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:02 EST 2009] tortexal so i have some
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:05 EST 2009] tortexal 1 sec
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:37 EST 2009] tortexal http://www.direxionshares.com/pdfs/Understanding_Exchange_Traded_Funds.pdf
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:50 EST 2009] tortexal that link is esecntially the inscrution manual for FAS
[Sun Jan 25 17:16:53 EST 2009] tortexal and FAZ alike
[Sun Jan 25 17:17:27 EST 2009] tortexal page 5 of the doccument will illustrate the change in mkt price versus the underlying portfolio after a rebalence when it takes a loss
[Sun Jan 25 17:17:46 EST 2009] tortexal take a sec to look at those bar charts
[Sun Jan 25 17:18:14 EST 2009] tortexal mkt price is reduced by $9 where as the actual loss to NAV was only 3$
[Sun Jan 25 17:18:39 EST 2009] tortexal thats bc of leverage and the rebalanceing to keep the proper #:1 ratios
[Sun Jan 25 17:18:41 EST 2009] tortexal 3:01
[Sun Jan 25 17:19:04 EST 2009] tortexal this is exactly why leveraged ETFS are specifically desiged to NOT be held over night
[Sun Jan 25 17:19:09 EST 2009] tortexal unlike a stock
[Sun Jan 25 17:19:45 EST 2009] tortexal another reason why its important to not hold an ETF over night is two fold
[Sun Jan 25 17:20:15 EST 2009] tortexal if the funds performance declines, so does the underlying portflio of the fund and its overall market exposure
[Sun Jan 25 17:21:00 EST 2009] tortexal therefore, the impact of further declines will minimize the volatility of the etfs as well intraday since it has less exposure
[Sun Jan 25 17:21:11 EST 2009] tortexal as the fund increases in perfomrance it will be come much mroe volatile
[Sun Jan 25 17:21:32 EST 2009] tortexal volatile as indicated by $$ change during the day
[Sun Jan 25 17:21:49 EST 2009] tortexal ex of this, then FAZ moves its moved in 1.00/share at a time usually
[Sun Jan 25 17:21:58 EST 2009] tortexal vs FAS which is only .05 usually
[Sun Jan 25 17:22:18 EST 2009] tortexal thats bc FAS bas been beaten down and will move on a $/share basis less than FAZ that has been performing “better”
[Sun Jan 25 17:22:25 EST 2009] tortexal thats mporant
[Sun Jan 25 17:22:44 EST 2009] tortexal because say you take a loss on FAS and it declines further in price yet you keep holding on
[Sun Jan 25 17:23:23 EST 2009] tortexal the fund will not only rebalance further downward in market price, it will also take more time to generate enough $/share when it imporoves in performance to get you back to where you entered to break even
[Sun Jan 25 17:23:46 EST 2009] tortexal so if you get stuck in a login position and for some reason hang on to it overnight, it’ll take you wayyyy more time to regain your loss
[Sun Jan 25 17:24:04 EST 2009] tortexal hopefully some of that makes sense 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 17:24:10 EST 2009] tortexal the other thing about holding o/n
[Sun Jan 25 17:24:39 EST 2009] tortexal a lot of people previously around the world thoght that if they held SKF, another inverse financial ETF, they would come out way ahead long term
[Sun Jan 25 17:25:06 EST 2009] tortexal it is true that the sector went down, but they maye have lost money as well by holding!
[Sun Jan 25 17:25:21 EST 2009] tortexal that is because the portfolio is also not compounded when it gains in performance
[Sun Jan 25 17:25:53 EST 2009] tortexal the ETF is ****ONLY**** designed to mirror (or try to) the performance of the underlying assest for that ***1 trading day ***
[Sun Jan 25 17:26:00 EST 2009] tortexal i have another pic of that 1 sec
[Sun Jan 25 17:26:21 EST 2009] tortexal http://www.proshares.com/funds/performance/UnderstandingProSharesLongTermPerformance.html
[Sun Jan 25 17:26:31 EST 2009] tortexal another fantastic page
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:05 EST 2009] tortexal someone a few days ago said that leveraged etfs are similar to jumping on a trampoline while hitting a ball on a paddle
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:16 EST 2009] tortexal that is a great analogy
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:20 EST 2009] tortexal and i’ll explain why
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:36 EST 2009] tortexal in addition to all of the variables we just talked about that affect the mkt price of the ETF
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:43 EST 2009] tortexal theres more stuff that affects it!
[Sun Jan 25 17:27:49 EST 2009] tortexal grab a ::beer
[Sun Jan 25 17:28:01 EST 2009] tortexal since ETFS are traded intraday
[Sun Jan 25 17:28:26 EST 2009] tortexal their mkt price will naturally fluctuate based on supply and demand durring a specifi point in time, justlike a stock
[Sun Jan 25 17:28:41 EST 2009] tortexal however, remember that the goal of an ETF is to track an underlying index
[Sun Jan 25 17:29:15 EST 2009] tortexal but because of increased volatility, momentium, time of day, volumne lack of liquidity, you name it, the actual mkt price of the ETf can SUBSTANTIALLY deviate form the actual underlying asset
[Sun Jan 25 17:29:53 EST 2009] tortexal now this is import to remember and be aware of especially at market open and during time when the mkt/sector/underlying asset/ has an increase in volatility
[Sun Jan 25 17:30:17 EST 2009] tortexal during these times the mkt price isn’t acurate at all or an accurate depicion of what **should** actually be happening
[Sun Jan 25 17:30:38 EST 2009] tortexal for ex, on fri at market open, for breif periods of time FAS and FAZ were BOTH increasing in mkt price
[Sun Jan 25 17:30:42 EST 2009] tortexal at the same time
[Sun Jan 25 17:31:22 EST 2009] tortexal this *shoulnt* be the case because they are supposed to be opposites of one anothers, but because mkt open is a very volatile time of day, people are trying to figureout whats going to happen
[Sun Jan 25 17:31:43 EST 2009] tortexal as a result supply and demand descrepancies made these ETFS performn completely counter to the say they in theory should
[Sun Jan 25 17:31:56 EST 2009] tortexal i have more pics to show estreeme cases of this 1 sec
[Sun Jan 25 17:32:14 EST 2009] tortexal http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3122/3227182600_6480af5da6_o.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 17:32:30 EST 2009] tortexal thats RIFN, the russle 1000 financial index
[Sun Jan 25 17:32:50 EST 2009] tortexal its tracked, at least in part, by many financial etfs
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:07 EST 2009] tortexal I personally do not use this as in indicator to trade from but we’ll talk more about that later
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:17 EST 2009] tortexal look at whhat i have circled at open in that pick
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:33 EST 2009] tortexal http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3536/3226330773_8f8fc1a4a1_o.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:35 EST 2009] tortexal theres XLF
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:50 EST 2009] tortexal XLF is supopsed to track RIFIN
[Sun Jan 25 17:33:59 EST 2009] tortexal note the difefrence in candled at open
[Sun Jan 25 17:34:02 EST 2009] tortexal candles
[Sun Jan 25 17:34:05 EST 2009] tortexal it doesnt match
[Sun Jan 25 17:34:17 EST 2009] tortexal also note the dumps at_13:15 am and eod
[Sun Jan 25 17:34:22 EST 2009] tortexal .30 dumps
[Sun Jan 25 17:34:40 EST 2009] tortexal when the underlying asset didnt have thoses changes in value
[Sun Jan 25 17:35:08 EST 2009] tortexal this is why you dont use moving averages for enter/exit/signals on etfs
[Sun Jan 25 17:35:23 EST 2009] tortexal the extreems in price movement will throw off the math
[Sun Jan 25 17:35:40 EST 2009] tortexal the trend should slign wo a problem
[Sun Jan 25 17:35:45 EST 2009] tortexal but you cant rely on the crosses
[Sun Jan 25 17:36:05 EST 2009] InvestorsLive It’s important to note that FAZ and FAS is a great stock for flipping/scalping. I would personally recommend stocks off the HOD List to those under the PDT.
[Sun Jan 25 17:36:13 EST 2009] InvestorsLive FAS and FAZ are not always this great, they are not always this predictable and they have increased volatility when theres a ton of fear in the market place.. as you have seen risking only 100 shares we can easily scalp/flip for $1-2 dollars in a matter of minutes
[Sun Jan 25 17:36:17 EST 2009] tortexal and that is bc the mkt price will not always track 100%
[Sun Jan 25 17:36:30 EST 2009] tortexal and if you see a big dump like that you may say, crap i have to exit
[Sun Jan 25 17:36:46 EST 2009] tortexal but you would have to bc the free mkt will even eventually correct itself
[Sun Jan 25 17:37:01 EST 2009] tortexal yeah if your under PDT dont go anywhere near any of this
[Sun Jan 25 17:37:14 EST 2009] InvestorsLive There are plenty of plays jumping up intraday – personally like Tort said the morning spike/drop may be a complete fake.. I tend to wait 10 minutes and find out where the general direction is going to take it
[Sun Jan 25 17:37:36 EST 2009] tortexal yes imo you need to wait
[Sun Jan 25 17:38:10 EST 2009] Laura yes, someone last week used their 3rd trade on FAS or FAZ and had to hold o/n.
[Sun Jan 25 17:38:20 EST 2009] thahound that was me
[Sun Jan 25 17:38:28 EST 2009] tortexal and to ILs point the volatility is what more better/worse (depending on if youre o the right side or wrong side) because the moves are maganized by 3x normal!
[Sun Jan 25 17:38:47 EST 2009] Laura Don’t do it if it’s your last trade. Or any trade actually, since you have to be in/out quick multiple times.
[Sun Jan 25 17:39:17 EST 2009] tortexal yes you have to play very quick unless you have big cohonas
[Sun Jan 25 17:39:23 EST 2009] tortexal bc ver volatile
[Sun Jan 25 17:39:42 EST 2009] tortexal to give you an example, i think IL, Muddy myself play FAZ for 1.00 moves
[Sun Jan 25 17:39:56 EST 2009] tortexal that can happen in 30 sec, if your not quick you can LOSE that 1.00/share
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:04 EST 2009] tortexal or more if yur slow
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:20 EST 2009] InvestorsLive COCO, CDNS, CCO, HIG, LNC all HOD-ers all day.. so its not like there isn’t plenty of plays out there.. the thing is it’s not every day volatility like this is in the market.. and when there is its a gift and we have to take advantage of it
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:21 EST 2009] tortexal the others thing, these are SO volatile, you cant use LMT orders imo
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:32 EST 2009] InvestorsLive if anyone has quesitons on ETFs so far please feel free to PM me
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:42 EST 2009] Laura no limit orders agreed
[Sun Jan 25 17:40:53 EST 2009] InvestorsLive lighter has a bit more to cover just sharpening his pencil ..
[Sun Jan 25 17:41:33 EST 2009] tortexal the only thing you can possible to imo, if yo have time, is add a trail stop of a small% 1.5-2% to protectyourself from a pull back when/if it runs
[Sun Jan 25 17:42:15 EST 2009] InvestorsLive One other thing I noticed last week that is a good thing to cover.. is chasing these plays on the breakouts, I normally buy them in areas of intraday support based on other indexes for the quick move.. if you are chasing the breakout your entering dangerously
[Sun Jan 25 17:43:08 EST 2009] tortexal for new people imporant thing to realize if that these levered ETFS have many moving parts to them as far as how they work. and as a result if you dont fully understand the moving parts and how you can LOSE from them, do not play them
[Sun Jan 25 17:43:49 EST 2009] tortexal IL if you want you can post some questions i’ll try to answer
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:00 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Question: if tort says don’t use moving avgs for entry/exit in FAS/FAZ, what would he recommend to use?
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:06 EST 2009] InvestorsLive is the only one
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:09 EST 2009] tortexal nice!
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:14 EST 2009] tortexal good question
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:23 EST 2009] InvestorsLive like I mentioned Friday – one thing that I do, I ALWAYS pull up the top bank stock for the day..
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:26 EST 2009] InvestorsLive but take it away tort 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:28 EST 2009] tortexal i only use XLF whcih is the benchmark of the intraday financal sector
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:56 EST 2009] tortexal the reason why i use that is because if you looked back at the RIFIN charts, its intraday movement een on 1min has gaps in it
[Sun Jan 25 17:44:59 EST 2009] tortexal XLF never will
[Sun Jan 25 17:45:21 EST 2009] tortexal funny to watch FAS and FAZ jump the gun anticipating movements in XLF
[Sun Jan 25 17:45:34 EST 2009] tortexal they will imdeadily pull back if XLf doesnt move
[Sun Jan 25 17:45:48 EST 2009] tortexal so what i do is just watch key support and resistance levels in XLF
[Sun Jan 25 17:46:05 EST 2009] tortexal and enter based on that
[Sun Jan 25 17:46:30 EST 2009] tortexal and exit when i hit 1.00/share on FAZ or .10 on FAS or if it keeeps going until i get stoppe dout on a pullback if i get a tail stop in on time
[Sun Jan 25 17:46:41 EST 2009] tortexal ok the thing too
[Sun Jan 25 17:46:49 EST 2009] tortexal i can play these fast bc my IB screen is all hotkeyed
[Sun Jan 25 17:47:07 EST 2009] tortexal i hit one buitton on keyboard im in, one button im out instantly
[Sun Jan 25 17:47:20 EST 2009] tortexal point and click will slow you down
[Sun Jan 25 17:47:27 EST 2009] tortexal any more ?s
[Sun Jan 25 17:47:44 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Question: How do you decide if you need to short an etf or buy the other one?
[Sun Jan 25 17:47:55 EST 2009] InvestorsLive It was just pretty much answered … however
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:01 EST 2009] tortexal i am lucky, i cant decide bc my broker wont let me
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:01 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I can’t short FAS or FAZ unfortunately
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:07 EST 2009] tortexal i can only play FAZ long or FAS short
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:15 EST 2009] tortexal well
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:18 EST 2009] tortexal i can only play either long
[Sun Jan 25 17:48:29 EST 2009] tortexal haha but FAZ shorts the asset FAS longs it
[Sun Jan 25 17:49:02 EST 2009] Laura right, IB only allows buys
[Sun Jan 25 17:49:14 EST 2009] tortexal now interesting phenoma w/ these
[Sun Jan 25 17:49:19 EST 2009] Laura and you may be surprised, but the ADR is higher on FAS than it is on FAZ
[Sun Jan 25 17:49:40 EST 2009] tortexal there is a loophole where you can make more money going long by shorting FAZ vs buying FAS long
[Sun Jan 25 17:50:11 EST 2009] tortexal that is bc when the fund is rebalanced, FAZ will drop more dollers to the down side
[Sun Jan 25 17:50:13 EST 2009] tortexal then you cover
[Sun Jan 25 17:50:23 EST 2009] tortexal so you get extra $$/shhare for free and by doing nothing
[Sun Jan 25 17:50:57 EST 2009] tortexal bc you capture the decline + rebalance downward, thats more advanced stuff and beyon the scope of what we should focus on imo for new people
[Sun Jan 25 17:51:17 EST 2009] tortexal old folks can fire away on that and make a killing
[Sun Jan 25 17:51:26 EST 2009] tortexal ok new topic of no more ?s
[Sun Jan 25 17:51:41 EST 2009] tortexal i have some questions from last week that i can try to help answer
[Sun Jan 25 17:51:54 EST 2009] tortexal 1) After running the various Stockfetcher scans [i.e. – RFR, Combo, I’m Gonna Try, etc] they often yield hundreds, if not thousands of stocks with multiple columns and lots of data to digest. The question is therefore, what are we suppose to be looking for so we parse these list down to a more manageable size. Additionally, are there any tips or tricks to tweak these scans to our own personal tastes?
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:10 EST 2009] tortexal 2 part question
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:14 EST 2009] tortexal first part
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:25 EST 2009] tortexal yes you will sometimes get a ton of results
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:39 EST 2009] tortexal you should filter those typically by however the scans was designed to be filtered
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:49 EST 2009] tortexal for ex, combo scan is filtered by ADR(30)
[Sun Jan 25 17:52:59 EST 2009] tortexal as Muddy indicated in the last seminar
[Sun Jan 25 17:53:04 EST 2009] tortexal so i have a pic on how to do that 1 sec
[Sun Jan 25 17:53:20 EST 2009] tortexal http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3403/3227339296_ba1cb3ab91_o.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 17:53:55 EST 2009] tortexal that scan got me 211 results, i dont want to watch that many, so click the ADR30 col to sort by highest to lowest
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:02 EST 2009] tortexal me personally then i take the top 40 refults from that
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:13 EST 2009] tortexal i take 40 bc thhats all i can see inside TOS w/o having to scroll
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:22 EST 2009] tortexal 2nd part of ?
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:27 EST 2009] tortexal how to tweak
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:31 EST 2009] tortexal that will come with time
[Sun Jan 25 17:54:54 EST 2009] tortexal you personally will see trends that you easily pick up on and feel comfortable trading, such as higher float, more vol, higher price etc
[Sun Jan 25 17:55:04 EST 2009] Laura one tweak is to tweak the ADR number in the scan. keep tweaking it up to get about 40 watches.
[Sun Jan 25 17:55:28 EST 2009] tortexal once you have an idea of what YOU like, then just modify the code a bit to refine what your looking for. also the SF forums are great place for code examples, very useful
[Sun Jan 25 17:56:00 EST 2009] Laura yes, you have to do some work to understand the code, and what things you might want to tweak.
[Sun Jan 25 17:56:17 EST 2009] Laura tweak vol, tweak ADR, tweak % up in 1/2 days.
[Sun Jan 25 17:57:09 EST 2009] Laura no one’s watchlist has to match someone elses exactly. the point is to find stocks that have a “BETTER THAN AVERAGE” chance of making a big move.
[Sun Jan 25 17:57:26 EST 2009] tortexal definitly
[Sun Jan 25 17:57:35 EST 2009] tortexal its all probability and odds
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:04 EST 2009] Laura Muddy gets emails on “why they can’t get the exact 40 stocks” that he did.
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:15 EST 2009] tortexal bc you’ll get 211 of them =P
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:24 EST 2009] Laura It cuz he tweaks it for 5-10 minutes to find the ones he likes.
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:39 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Another question I got: Since Scottrade does not activate its “HOD List” until after the Market opens [at 9:30 EST] , what does Muddy use to generate the morning “Pre List”?
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:45 EST 2009] InvestorsLive This one is pretty easy..
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:49 EST 2009] Laura yes
[Sun Jan 25 17:58:54 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Yes HOD List doesn’t start printing to market hours
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:04 EST 2009] InvestorsLive the Pre List is generated from Interactive Brokers
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:24 EST 2009] InvestorsLive This week pre.. some asked “it only printed 1k shares! or 5k shares.. ” etc
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:24 EST 2009] Laura If you don’t use IB, then use nasdaq.com to find some.
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:35 EST 2009] InvestorsLive the main reason we use the Pre List is to find
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive POTENTIAL
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:40 EST 2009] InvestorsLive plays for the day
[Sun Jan 25 17:59:42 EST 2009] tortexal btw IB has a new software release for TWS for those who use it, go to their website and download and install, the auto updater doesnt always work properly
[Sun Jan 25 18:00:03 EST 2009] InvestorsLive its a cheat sheet to stocks on the move early.. which we focus on through the day
[Sun Jan 25 18:00:18 EST 2009] InvestorsLive many times if they were a pre leader I watch for them to consolidate through the day and head back to pre-market levels
[Sun Jan 25 18:00:30 EST 2009] InvestorsLive IWOV was a perfect example of that this week
[Sun Jan 25 18:00:38 EST 2009] Laura sure, some don’t do anything great from the pre-list, but many do.
[Sun Jan 25 18:01:54 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 1. A lot of the prehits that are up on earnings/drug news like to run when they reach important intraday resistance levels. Are there more or less premarket long plays (like GERN from this past Friday) in bullish market conditions?
[Sun Jan 25 18:02:40 EST 2009] tortexal most pre hits are def potential longs unless they prove otherwise
[Sun Jan 25 18:02:52 EST 2009] tortexal just watch them around even marks and making nhods
[Sun Jan 25 18:02:56 EST 2009] InvestorsLive GERN chart: http://tinyurl.com/ccjcu3
[Sun Jan 25 18:03:27 EST 2009] tortexal but to properly answer the question (silly me) yes
[Sun Jan 25 18:03:35 EST 2009] tortexal bull mkt more likely to keep running
[Sun Jan 25 18:03:43 EST 2009] tortexal and more plays
[Sun Jan 25 18:04:31 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 2. Is your current scan criteria for premarket leaders–i.e. up at least 5% with at least 1000 shares traded–different in bullish market conditions? If so, what is your scan criteria in bull markets?
[Sun Jan 25 18:04:46 EST 2009] Laura yet the explosive moves can happen any market conditions. some catalyst is making them move which is independent of the general market.
[Sun Jan 25 18:05:35 EST 2009] InvestorsLive the criteria doesn’t change, its just a list of stocks that have traded pre market
[Sun Jan 25 18:05:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive its not very complex
[Sun Jan 25 18:05:42 EST 2009] Laura same basic scan for us.
[Sun Jan 25 18:05:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive its just a cheat sheet of the trades that MAY be in play
[Sun Jan 25 18:05:54 EST 2009] InvestorsLive gives us a ‘focus’ for the morning
[Sun Jan 25 18:06:00 EST 2009] tortexal as far as pre scan, personally i may have no way of knowing how i’lll interpret that yet i’ll have to see what works when we get there
[Sun Jan 25 18:06:16 EST 2009] Laura more important than this being a bear market imo, is that it is a very volatile market.
[Sun Jan 25 18:07:08 EST 2009] tortexal : I am having a problem with the pre-market list. I note them every day, but when, just before, and after the bell, there are many other tickers that are suggested. As, this is the most frenzied activity of the day, and so many possibilies showing up it leaves an inexperienced momo. traded both bewildered
[Sun Jan 25 18:07:38 EST 2009] tortexal what you do is watch the tickers to hit even dollar marks
[Sun Jan 25 18:07:53 EST 2009] tortexal easiest way to do it
[Sun Jan 25 18:08:09 EST 2009] InvestorsLive You don’t have to trade the first 10 minutes, I rarely do
[Sun Jan 25 18:08:18 EST 2009] Laura same here IL
[Sun Jan 25 18:09:02 EST 2009] Laura GERN yes, most no
[Sun Jan 25 18:09:19 EST 2009] Laura a strong catalyst for it to continue higher
[Sun Jan 25 18:09:49 EST 2009] tortexal yes ex that FDA news on stem cell research. be on the lookout for other stem cell biotecks to start flying
[Sun Jan 25 18:10:09 EST 2009] tortexal and i doubt STEM is done yet, that is not a RECO just keep an eye on it
[Sun Jan 25 18:10:24 EST 2009] InvestorsLive STEM / ASTM / ACTC
[Sun Jan 25 18:10:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive speaking of sector stocks .. which as you saw the new dashboard is in.. will have updates shortly
[Sun Jan 25 18:10:55 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and you’ll be able to pick a sector and easily pull up stocks within it
[Sun Jan 25 18:11:14 EST 2009] tortexal thhats cool
[Sun Jan 25 18:11:46 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 2. If I am using StockFetcher, can I run the recommended scans with the free account or do I need one of the paid for services? If I need a paid for service, which one, the Standard or the Advanced?
[Sun Jan 25 18:11:58 EST 2009] tortexal buy standard service for 9$
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:08 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 3. It appears the HOD list on Scottrade is very vital to y’alls strategy. Since I have to put $500 in a Scottrade account, should I suck it up and do that now, or can I wait until $500 would not be such a big deal to lose in my trading account?
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:12 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I don’t have any money in it..
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:18 EST 2009] InvestorsLive haven’t been asked yet
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:24 EST 2009] tortexal haha
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:34 EST 2009] InvestorsLive just open an account at scottrade.. and use the services, if they complain .. yes put $500 in
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:38 EST 2009] tortexal i had one acc there prior w/o $$ in it and it got closed
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:46 EST 2009] tortexal so i opened another under a diff address a sa diff location
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:54 EST 2009] tortexal we’lls ee what happens 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 18:12:57 EST 2009] Laura I’ve heard of a lot of peeps that open scott acct and never fund it.
[Sun Jan 25 18:13:19 EST 2009] tortexal lighter told the office i regd at now that he lost all his $$ in LEH
[Sun Jan 25 18:13:25 EST 2009] tortexal i may try that if it comes up
[Sun Jan 25 18:13:36 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 4. You, Muddy and many others really drive home the importance of running the scans every night/week. Is there a time, after the markets close, that the daily scans should be run, or can I run them any time after the market closes?
[Sun Jan 25 18:13:38 EST 2009] Laura If a smaller acct,then why not fund it with $500-1000 and trade there too in addition to main acct.
[Sun Jan 25 18:14:04 EST 2009] Laura run scans anytime after they update daily data.
[Sun Jan 25 18:14:19 EST 2009] tortexal 15-30 min after mkt should be fine, their #s are updated through out the day too
[Sun Jan 25 18:14:41 EST 2009] Laura yeah, they used to only update EOD I think a few years ago.
[Sun Jan 25 18:14:59 EST 2009] tortexal its delayed inttra but idk by how much
[Sun Jan 25 18:15:14 EST 2009] Laura you can’t do SF scans with free acct, you have to have the $9 a month one. No need for advanced tho.
[Sun Jan 25 18:15:44 EST 2009] Laura We’ve been paying 9 a month for 5-6 yrs, no increase.
[Sun Jan 25 18:16:17 EST 2009] tortexal and if somethings broken you email them they fiix it right away
[Sun Jan 25 18:17:55 EST 2009] tortexal if you have a question shoot IL a pm we’re happy to answer until lighter arrives
[Sun Jan 25 18:19:00 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Question: tort mentioned using hotkeys in IB. is that an IB specific feature?
[Sun Jan 25 18:19:48 EST 2009] tortexal its a featuire of IB, tos doesnt do it idk what other brokers do
[Sun Jan 25 18:20:16 EST 2009] Laura I’m bad, I’ve been doing point-click buy/sell
[Sun Jan 25 18:20:22 EST 2009] Laura I need to do the hotkeys too.
[Sun Jan 25 18:21:03 EST 2009] Laura I use one hotkey to set alarms. I can set alarms on prices below and above X point which is nice for monitoring multiple positions.
[Sun Jan 25 18:21:47 EST 2009] tortexal my hot key set up is: F1 pulls ups mkt depth window F2 updates LMT order price to that of b/a depending on if im buy/selling F3 is hard stop attached to buy order, F4 is trail ~ key closed order
[Sun Jan 25 18:22:07 EST 2009] Laura nice tip tort
[Sun Jan 25 18:22:22 EST 2009] tortexal i use 4 fingers to trade with basically
[Sun Jan 25 18:22:41 EST 2009] Laura thank god, cuz you can’t spell using 4………..::laugh
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:06 EST 2009] tortexal i type w 2 fingers
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:11 EST 2009] tortexal 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:18 EST 2009] Laura and one’s broken right?
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:24 EST 2009] tortexal :POOF:
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:28 EST 2009] Laura lol
[Sun Jan 25 18:23:38 EST 2009] Laura lighter takes the stage…………….
[Sun Jan 25 18:24:07 EST 2009] lighter The main topic of tonight’s seminar is trading the ETFs, which we’ve been doing a lot on this past week, mainly in FAS/FAZ
[Sun Jan 25 18:24:40 EST 2009] lighter I’m going to go through quick trade using real screenshot chart from this past week
[Sun Jan 25 18:26:41 EST 2009] lighter First off, ETFs are not single company stocks. You cannot used 10/60 crosses on them, and they do not behave in the same way as individual stocks do. They are useful to play now because we are in times of very high volatility. In normal markets, I usually only play them on big trend days, large news catalysts, etc.
[Sun Jan 25 18:27:25 EST 2009] lighter I’m using very simple Technical Analysis when trading, whether its at ETF or regular stock
[Sun Jan 25 18:28:09 EST 2009] lighter You should be familiar with basic support and resistance levels. I know most of you are. But I’ve gotten some messages this past week to the contrary. You should read up more on this in your free time when you can.
[Sun Jan 25 18:28:23 EST 2009] lighter I’m going to start with a 5day screenshot of this past trading week
[Sun Jan 25 18:28:40 EST 2009] lighter http://i41.tinypic.com/63u350.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 18:29:17 EST 2009] lighter (The shaded white areas are the Pre-market/Afterhours sessions)
[Sun Jan 25 18:29:31 EST 2009] lighter If you have any questions while I’m doing this, PM to IL and he’ll send to me
[Sun Jan 25 18:30:16 EST 2009] lighter so basically you can see Mon and Tues, FAS (3x Financial ETF) was down
[Sun Jan 25 18:30:28 EST 2009] lighter Wed up, Thurs down, Fri up
[Sun Jan 25 18:31:08 EST 2009] lighter Now I’ll move on to trading day for Wednesday where FAS had a big move to the upside
[Sun Jan 25 18:32:09 EST 2009] lighter Screenshot from Tue/Wed trading sessions this past week: http://i43.tinypic.com/5fn1cg.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 18:32:25 EST 2009] lighter This is very basic example of support and resistance levels
[Sun Jan 25 18:32:53 EST 2009] lighter Any of you should be able to pull up a chart and see these general, POTENTIAL areas of support/resistance on any chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:33:08 EST 2009] lighter remember, they are POTENTIAL areas where buyers or sellers show up
[Sun Jan 25 18:33:31 EST 2009] lighter and generally provide the best risk/reward if you base your trade entries at those areas
[Sun Jan 25 18:34:19 EST 2009] lighter tort watches XLF intraday to base his FAS/FAZ trades
[Sun Jan 25 18:34:44 EST 2009] lighter I personally don’t. You’re again just using basic Technical Analysis on the chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:34:53 EST 2009] lighter find general areas of support and resistance
[Sun Jan 25 18:35:17 EST 2009] lighter I do look at a chart of one of the indices intraday, however
[Sun Jan 25 18:36:07 EST 2009] lighter I use either the e-mini futures chart of the DOW (/YM) or S&P (/ES) or Nasdaq (/NQ)
[Sun Jan 25 18:36:16 EST 2009] lighter or you can just use the ETFs for those indices
[Sun Jan 25 18:36:24 EST 2009] lighter DIA, SPY, QQQQ respectively
[Sun Jan 25 18:36:49 EST 2009] lighter for me personally, especially since like tort we’re not really using limit orders on these because they move so fast
[Sun Jan 25 18:37:44 EST 2009] lighter looking at XLF intraday is redundant. you could say the same for one of the broad market indices as well, but what i want to know from them is how the rest of the market is performing, and if theres any HUGE market news/catalysts thats pushing everything up
[Sun Jan 25 18:37:57 EST 2009] lighter most stocks will follow the general market
[Sun Jan 25 18:38:54 EST 2009] lighter Next is two screenshots of FAS trading day Wednesday, and DOW futures trading day Wednesday
[Sun Jan 25 18:39:15 EST 2009] lighter just focus on the FAS chart, though. I put all of the trend lines on that one
[Sun Jan 25 18:39:48 EST 2009] lighter http://i41.tinypic.com/1nyzjd.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 18:40:10 EST 2009] lighter http:////i41.tinypic.com/14sjvb6.jpg
[Sun Jan 25 18:40:29 EST 2009] lighter Now if you look at the FAS chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:40:44 EST 2009] lighter this is all stuff that you should INSTANTLY see in your head when you pull up a chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:40:55 EST 2009] lighter I dont have any lines drawn on my charts intraday
[Sun Jan 25 18:41:17 EST 2009] lighter you should just be able to recognize general areas where the stock is bouncing off of
[Sun Jan 25 18:41:22 EST 2009] lighter of pulling back from
[Sun Jan 25 18:42:03 EST 2009] lighter that bottom level of potential support was from the previous day (tuesday – check the other chart linked above)
[Sun Jan 25 18:42:27 EST 2009] lighter but eventually found trading support during the day at around $8 level
[Sun Jan 25 18:42:50 EST 2009] lighter and bounced off $8.30-8.50 area
[Sun Jan 25 18:43:29 EST 2009] lighter you can buy or sell off these these general s/r areas again for best risk-reward
[Sun Jan 25 18:43:46 EST 2009] lighter and place stops/covers right outside of those areas
[Sun Jan 25 18:44:25 EST 2009] lighter So, on Wednesday, there was big market catalyst that drove up the market, but the financials in particular
[Sun Jan 25 18:44:34 EST 2009] lighter Insider buying in BAC, JPM, etc
[Sun Jan 25 18:45:02 EST 2009] lighter you can see on the chart at that particular moment, FAS approached resistance level for 3rd time and broke out
[Sun Jan 25 18:45:26 EST 2009] lighter thats where you want to get getting involved
[Sun Jan 25 18:45:39 EST 2009] lighter on big catalyst days like Fed days, even moreso
[Sun Jan 25 18:46:01 EST 2009] lighter last Fed day, Dec 16th, FAS had big upside move on huge volume
[Sun Jan 25 18:46:33 EST 2009] lighter once it breaks out, if you arent in already, dont chase it – they always pull back to test a support level
[Sun Jan 25 18:46:49 EST 2009] lighter in this case, they broke out and pulled back to $8.60
[Sun Jan 25 18:47:09 EST 2009] lighter if you look over on left side of the chart, $8.60 was former resistance
[Sun Jan 25 18:47:17 EST 2009] lighter it now acted as support
[Sun Jan 25 18:47:34 EST 2009] lighter then it was basically making higher highs, higher lows from there
[Sun Jan 25 18:48:00 EST 2009] lighter if you see it run up on a big green candle, dont chase. just wait for it to pull back again and buy it at a support level for best risk-reward
[Sun Jan 25 18:48:21 EST 2009] lighter near the end of the day, another example of resistance becoming a level of support
[Sun Jan 25 18:49:01 EST 2009] lighter remember not to let emotions get to you in the heat of the moment if the stock is running away and you didnt act quick enough. they always pull back and let people on board
[Sun Jan 25 18:50:28 EST 2009] InvestorsLive If you had trouble clicking view charts here: http://www.investorsunderground.com/2009/01/25/charts-covered-by-lighter-in-seminar-3/#more-1708
[Sun Jan 25 18:50:55 EST 2009] lighter Another thing about basic support/resistance levels. if a stock keeps repeatedly hits on a certain area, its more than likely to breakout or breakdown from it. the stock is basically knocking at the door there
[Sun Jan 25 18:51:02 EST 2009] Laura lighter, super explanation of S/R
[Sun Jan 25 18:51:26 EST 2009] lighter In general though, this is very very simple and should be kept simple
[Sun Jan 25 18:51:35 EST 2009] lighter We’re just using basic support/resistance levels
[Sun Jan 25 18:51:48 EST 2009] lighter which give you as a trader the best entry points to make a purchase
[Sun Jan 25 18:52:00 EST 2009] lighter it gives you some idea on where to bailout if the trade isnt working
[Sun Jan 25 18:52:53 EST 2009] lighter and on a day like this past wednesday in particular, if you see big news catalyst, you can make a ton of money very fast without be sketched out on random bouncing around of stocks. one reason fed days, etc are fun to play. you get huge momentum swings
[Sun Jan 25 18:53:01 EST 2009] lighter and you can make a lot of money very quickly if you know how to play it
[Sun Jan 25 18:53:29 EST 2009] lighter If you have any questions, send them to IL. I’ll go over a couple that were sent in
[Sun Jan 25 18:54:20 EST 2009] lighter 1st question: Should pre/aftermarket trading be taken into account when looking for S/R?
[Sun Jan 25 18:54:53 EST 2009] lighter You’re just generally looking for areas of potential s/r. on the TOS platform, it shows up as an option on the main charts there
[Sun Jan 25 18:55:52 EST 2009] lighter it’s been useful to me at times on particular stocks. like where theres a huge gap up overnight, sometimes i’ll see it pullback to an afterhours/premarket support area which you wouldnt see on just a regular daily market hours chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:55:59 EST 2009] lighter so it can be useful sometimes
[Sun Jan 25 18:56:27 EST 2009] lighter 2nd question: When news comes out how long before it is factored into a stock?
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:08 EST 2009] lighter You GENERALLY should not be following news too heavily. I personally dont read any websites during the day. I’ll have CNBC on in the background, but it’s usually almost mute. It’s good for occasional big market news, but you can see it on the tape as well when you see huge volume spikes, fast price action
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:22 EST 2009] lighter news comes out all the time
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:34 EST 2009] lighter you job generally is to NOT interpret it
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:39 EST 2009] lighter esp new traders
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:43 EST 2009] lighter because you’ll get it wrong
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:46 EST 2009] lighter you’ll buy on emotion
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:53 EST 2009] lighter and often that’s the wrong move
[Sun Jan 25 18:58:57 EST 2009] Laura aka the CNBC spike
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:09 EST 2009] lighter yes, the CNBC spike is one example
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:21 EST 2009] lighter where a stock is mentioned on air and shows a quick spike on the chart
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:26 EST 2009] Laura Mudd loves to short into those, but you have to be super quick
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:28 EST 2009] lighter you often can short into those
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:31 EST 2009] lighter exactly
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:34 EST 2009] lighter just be quick
[Sun Jan 25 18:59:44 EST 2009] Laura right, split second almost
[Sun Jan 25 19:00:07 EST 2009] Laura Don’t know what the deal was with LLNW on Friday, but almost seemed a CNBC spike.
[Sun Jan 25 19:00:18 EST 2009] Laura Perfect example of momo.
[Sun Jan 25 19:01:08 EST 2009] lighter but news in general is not something you all should be trying to interpret. a big reason is because your account will not move a market. its what the big hedge funds and institutions think that count. the market will move where the big money goes
[Sun Jan 25 19:01:42 EST 2009] lighter your job is to quickly pickup on the move in the market and hop on board, take a slice of the move, then move on
[Sun Jan 25 19:01:58 EST 2009] lighter we’re just trading these things
[Sun Jan 25 19:02:14 EST 2009] lighter we’re not holding for years and years
[Sun Jan 25 19:02:58 EST 2009] lighter Any other questions?
[Sun Jan 25 19:03:23 EST 2009] Laura someone earlier ask, how to spot momentum. look at 1-2 day chart on LLNW. basing/sideways/low volume.
[Sun Jan 25 19:03:25 EST 2009] InvestorsLive None here
[Sun Jan 25 19:03:39 EST 2009] InvestorsLive LLNW chart Laura mentioned
[Sun Jan 25 19:03:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive is here: http://www.investorsunderground.com/2009/01/23/Muddys-darkside-watchs-12609/
[Sun Jan 25 19:03:43 EST 2009] Laura then buyers appeared……….volume spiked, more buyers……price zoomed.
[Sun Jan 25 19:04:12 EST 2009] Laura you may not know (or care) why……….just play what’s happening.
[Sun Jan 25 19:04:19 EST 2009] guest how far back do you go looking for support/res for intraday trade
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:04 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I look for the move when its about to happen – I use 1 min chart during the day but have an idea of what the stock looks like from scans the night before
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:14 EST 2009] InvestorsLive some use 5 min – I believe tort does
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:20 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 5 min and 1 min next to it
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:35 EST 2009] guest i meant how far back in time
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive my chart shows me the full day
[Sun Jan 25 19:05:52 EST 2009] InvestorsLive intraday
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:14 EST 2009] guest so that means 5 min 1day or 1 min 1 day.. you are not looking at previous days/weeks.
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:23 EST 2009] tortexal yes for stocks i’ll use 1m next to 5 and a 5d5m and a 3m daily, ETFS 1m sharts
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:30 EST 2009] InvestorsLive guest…
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:32 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I use 1 min chart during the day but have an idea of what the stock looks like from scans the night before
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:32 EST 2009] tortexal charts*
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:45 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 2 month, 3 month etc
[Sun Jan 25 19:06:51 EST 2009] InvestorsLive same stuff I normally post on my scans
[Sun Jan 25 19:07:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive guys feel free to post questions if you have them
[Sun Jan 25 19:07:58 EST 2009] InvestorsLive you don’t have to PM me now.. but once 2-3 come by let them be answered first
[Sun Jan 25 19:08:23 EST 2009] guest so looks like all mods dont necessarily have same timeframe…
[Sun Jan 25 19:08:42 EST 2009] guest whatever one is comfortable with ? (like i am with 5min 1day, 5 min 2.5day)
[Sun Jan 25 19:08:44 EST 2009] mjinvestments been wondering about LLNW. is a chart like that appealing as a short/long right where it is now
[Sun Jan 25 19:08:50 EST 2009] mjinvestments sorru
[Sun Jan 25 19:08:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Correct. As you’ll notice and as I’ve said before you will mold into what works for you
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:09 EST 2009] SobelSaint What are some good ways to learn support and resistance?
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:10 EST 2009] lighter As long as you’re making money, it’s the correct timeframe.
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:15 EST 2009] lighter That’s all you need to know.
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:23 EST 2009] InvestorsLive like lighter said, all those things he painted onto the charts.. I see in my head.. and don’t need to draw them
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:27 EST 2009] lighter Learn what you can and adapt to what suits you best
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive over time once you do that a few times and see how plays pan out etc. .. you’ll start getting a feel for what works for you
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:45 EST 2009] lighter not everyone plays the same stock the same way too
[Sun Jan 25 19:09:55 EST 2009] guest lighter – you just covered S/R — are the breaks of trendlines also worth trade ?
[Sun Jan 25 19:10:03 EST 2009] lighter I tend to hold longer and capture the full move. IL does more scalping
[Sun Jan 25 19:10:11 EST 2009] guest like breaks of downtrend or uptrend lines.
[Sun Jan 25 19:10:20 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Sobel – Tort did a review of Brian Shannon’s book… great for TA
[Sun Jan 25 19:10:27 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and its similar to how we trade in here
[Sun Jan 25 19:11:00 EST 2009] InvestorsLive mj – it’s neither right now.. we’ll see what happens Monday
[Sun Jan 25 19:11:01 EST 2009] mjinvestments LLNW broke the trendline. I’m wondering if anyone would risk shorting it right where it is now
[Sun Jan 25 19:11:12 EST 2009] tortexal http://stackyourcream.blogspot.com/2009/01/book-review-technical-analysis-using.html book review
[Sun Jan 25 19:11:39 EST 2009] InvestorsLive it just broke major resistance.. if I was watching it I’d watch to see what happens when it re-test it
[Sun Jan 25 19:11:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive see if it holds support etc
[Sun Jan 25 19:12:11 EST 2009] InvestorsLive if it holds $3 may be a trend reversal.. it topped out there 3 previous times
[Sun Jan 25 19:12:14 EST 2009] toefur going through shannons book now. awesome for S/R
[Sun Jan 25 19:12:27 EST 2009] SobelSaint Anyone in here have experience with CyGroup or another Prop Firm to get around the PDT rule? Can you pm me.
[Sun Jan 25 19:13:30 EST 2009] rgaston25 is it possible a seminar will be held on the types of scans utilized in stockfetcher? What the scans mean, what we are looking for in each scan..etc…
[Sun Jan 25 19:14:21 EST 2009] lighter guest: yes, everyone here in general should be familiar with basic technical patterns. trendlines are important as they give you directional play rather than a choppy mess. i’d rather buy into a strong trend than trade around a stock that sits around the same place because you can put in your mental s/r areas. and yes, depending on timeframe, once it breaks it can be a warning to get out
[Sun Jan 25 19:14:42 EST 2009] gep With regard to the pre-list, what signals convince you to go long on a particular stock? I feel like I frequently buy at the top (or close to it) and lose money on the fade. How do you distinguish between those stocks that will fade and those that run?
[Sun Jan 25 19:15:25 EST 2009] lighter if you’re using a daily timeframe, sometimes the stock will break a trendline intraday but hold it at the end. you want to see things on a closing basis so you dont get shaken out. different for intraday though
[Sun Jan 25 19:15:45 EST 2009] guest thanks lighter — again, for intra-day plays – are intra day trendlines enough or one should loook at long term trend as well
[Sun Jan 25 19:15:56 EST 2009] guest this is one area where I am struggling right now —
[Sun Jan 25 19:16:14 EST 2009] guest for swing trades, I’d look at 1 month, 3 mon trend
[Sun Jan 25 19:16:22 EST 2009] guest but still have to figure out for intraday
[Sun Jan 25 19:18:13 EST 2009] lighter well, here’s just another basic key point of technical analysis: the longer a trend has been in place (in terms of time), the stronger it is
[Sun Jan 25 19:18:35 EST 2009] lighter so a daily/monthly would trump an intraday chart
[Sun Jan 25 19:18:56 EST 2009] guest for a swing trade yes..
[Sun Jan 25 19:19:01 EST 2009] guest but for an intra-day too ?
[Sun Jan 25 19:19:16 EST 2009] lighter i really dont reccomend swing plays at this particular moment because the market is still in the process of bottoming out and is too volatile
[Sun Jan 25 19:19:30 EST 2009] sabir8 I highly recommend looking for 15 min charts for a break for swing trades
[Sun Jan 25 19:19:50 EST 2009] Laura but later, I’m with lighter….I like swing trades the best…
[Sun Jan 25 19:19:52 EST 2009] lighter once its more stable and figures out which direction it wants to move in for the long term, thats when you can start looking for alot of individual stock swing plays
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:07 EST 2009] Laura too volatile now, but oh yeah, I like swings
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:31 EST 2009] lighter yeah, i love swing trading
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:35 EST 2009] guest you sort of answered my question indirectly then I guess
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:43 EST 2009] lighter its good especially for people under pdt
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:48 EST 2009] Laura yes
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:49 EST 2009] guest means for intra-day – dont look for long term trend… period.
[Sun Jan 25 19:20:49 EST 2009] lighter its just not good market conditions for that not though
[Sun Jan 25 19:21:02 EST 2009] Laura and good for people that work and can’t watch intraday
[Sun Jan 25 19:21:16 EST 2009] lighter well intraday you’re basing your trades on very short timeframes. basically scalping
[Sun Jan 25 19:21:39 EST 2009] lighter one good thing about swing trading is that you dont have to be so specific on your entry point like you do with daytrading
[Sun Jan 25 19:21:46 EST 2009] lighter because you’re buying into a PATTERN
[Sun Jan 25 19:22:04 EST 2009] lighter it doesnt matter as much what the entry is
[Sun Jan 25 19:22:24 EST 2009] lighter you just look for strong patterns. and other traders are seeing the same thing, which gives you directional support
[Sun Jan 25 19:22:44 EST 2009] lighter you’re buying in with the knowledge that you have other people putting up money behind you
[Sun Jan 25 19:23:46 EST 2009] lighter we’ll cover that more indepth later with real charts
[Sun Jan 25 19:24:07 EST 2009] guest Laura – yes for my comment or Lighters ?
[Sun Jan 25 19:24:17 EST 2009] lighter like this past summer in chat, we all rode up a few swing plays for huge gains. just not stable enough to do that now
[Sun Jan 25 19:25:05 EST 2009] Laura I meant swing trading is good for peeps that work and can’t watch daily
[Sun Jan 25 19:25:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Any other questions guys?
[Sun Jan 25 19:25:57 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Anything that came from last seminar.. applied this week
[Sun Jan 25 19:25:58 EST 2009] gep yeah, mine about 20 lines up…
[Sun Jan 25 19:25:59 EST 2009] Laura Conclude soon if not
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:00 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and still ???????s
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:09 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 1 sec gep
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:17 EST 2009] InvestorsLive gep: With regard to the pre-list, what signals convince you to go long on a particular stock? I feel like I frequently buy at the top (or close to it) and lose money on the fade. How do you distinguish between those stocks that will fade and those that run?
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:30 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I usually wait 10 minutes gep
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive watch for a base to form
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive sometimes even longer, I may do a few quick scalps in the first 30 minutes
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:52 EST 2009] Laura We may go in at open if the catalyst is strong.
[Sun Jan 25 19:26:57 EST 2009] InvestorsLive to get a padding for the day
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:02 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and then look for breaks off consolidation
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:16 EST 2009] InvestorsLive or if a stock is on the HOD list..
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:23 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I don’t always chase it just because but I monitor it
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:25 EST 2009] InvestorsLive for an entry
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:36 EST 2009] InvestorsLive it may spike, come back consolidate – and I look for that next move
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:37 EST 2009] habsfan50 what is considered a strong catalyst?
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive SAY perfect example the other day
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:50 EST 2009] guest that’s Muddy expertise area @gep.
[Sun Jan 25 19:27:56 EST 2009] guest playing with spikes
[Sun Jan 25 19:28:13 EST 2009] gep Yes, I caught SAY at the end…great call….I could see it perfectly….the others, I’m still working at
[Sun Jan 25 19:28:30 EST 2009] InvestorsLive good, so u saw that live..
[Sun Jan 25 19:28:32 EST 2009] InvestorsLive http://tinyurl.com/c3dauk
[Sun Jan 25 19:28:58 EST 2009] gep Yes…you called it, and the chart was very clear to me.
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:10 EST 2009] InvestorsLive that’s hand’s down what I look for
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:12 EST 2009] InvestorsLive 1pm on
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:31 EST 2009] toefur so entry on SAY @ 1.40?
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive another good one gep
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:55 EST 2009] InvestorsLive as far as a fade
[Sun Jan 25 19:29:58 EST 2009] InvestorsLive topping out etc
[Sun Jan 25 19:30:02 EST 2009] InvestorsLive http://tinyurl.com/dfp2lc
[Sun Jan 25 19:30:05 EST 2009] InvestorsLive AFL
[Sun Jan 25 19:30:34 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_12:07:34 ] InvestorsLive AFL failed to break $27.50, testing $27.10 support if broken could slide nicely
[Sun Jan 25 19:31:04 EST 2009] gep Yes. Almost bought the top here. Lots of discussion in chat….AFL!….almost pulled the trigger….but didn’t….glad I didn’t, too.
[Sun Jan 25 19:31:17 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_12:20:05 ] InvestorsLive AFL more lows since short
[Sun Jan 25 19:31:31 EST 2009] InvestorsLive AFL another perfect example
[Sun Jan 25 19:31:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive topped out twice
[Sun Jan 25 19:31:41 EST 2009] InvestorsLive watch for that..
[Sun Jan 25 19:32:05 EST 2009] guest did you short AFL after S break @ IL ?
[Sun Jan 25 19:32:17 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I short 27.20-30s
[Sun Jan 25 19:32:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive it was having trouble breaking over it.. didn’t hold gains..
[Sun Jan 25 19:32:45 EST 2009] InvestorsLive if it had.. I would have covered and cut loss
[Sun Jan 25 19:32:57 EST 2009] InvestorsLive but it had failed 2 or 3 times (this is watching on 1 min chart)
[Sun Jan 25 19:33:11 EST 2009] InvestorsLive u can see it clearly there at $27
[Sun Jan 25 19:33:31 EST 2009] InvestorsLive see how it created a ceiling?
[Sun Jan 25 19:33:57 EST 2009] InvestorsLive then I locked some in right away I think I mentioned +.50 locked some in so I could let the rest ride
[Sun Jan 25 19:34:02 EST 2009] guest yes, multiple times
[Sun Jan 25 19:34:06 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I always do that because it gives you a buffer
[Sun Jan 25 19:34:15 EST 2009] InvestorsLive you can let it ride a bit longer if you have profit on the play already
[Sun Jan 25 19:35:04 EST 2009] InvestorsLive the day before I highlighted that and compared it to STT
[Sun Jan 25 19:35:11 EST 2009] gep so basically, if i bought over 27 around_14:15am….and I see this stock drop under 27….create the ceiling….this would be the time to reverse and go short…because resistance at $27 is a strong indicator this thing will most likely fall
[Sun Jan 25 19:35:21 EST 2009] InvestorsLive http://www.InvestorsLive.com/2009/01/23/another-awesome-day-in-chat-watches-for-the-23rd-of-jan-2009/
[Sun Jan 25 19:36:16 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I would be looking for the short scalps rather than chasing a long on a day like that
[Sun Jan 25 19:36:20 EST 2009] InvestorsLive gep
[Sun Jan 25 19:36:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive but its a case of the even $s again
[Sun Jan 25 19:36:53 EST 2009] InvestorsLive $27s 28s etc
[Sun Jan 25 19:36:59 EST 2009] InvestorsLive also 27.50s specifically there
[Sun Jan 25 19:37:05 EST 2009] InvestorsLive i was watching for it to re-test
[Sun Jan 25 19:37:36 EST 2009] guest do you guys look at the general market trend for the day to be on the lookout for more short plays or long plays for the day ?
[Sun Jan 25 19:37:36 EST 2009] gep lots of a ha moments on this end….thanks.
[Sun Jan 25 19:38:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive a ha moments are good moments 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 19:38:58 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I always have INDU SPY up guest
[Sun Jan 25 19:39:16 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and usually the “stock of the day”
[Sun Jan 25 19:39:19 EST 2009] InvestorsLive whatever the main driver is that day
[Sun Jan 25 19:39:23 EST 2009] InvestorsLive earlier this week itw as IBM
[Sun Jan 25 19:39:52 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I watch BAC more than C .. but BAC / FAS / FAZ
[Sun Jan 25 19:40:08 EST 2009] InvestorsLive if I see something forming in FAS ahead of BAC I may jump in BAC
[Sun Jan 25 19:40:41 EST 2009] guest ok, thats because they are “related”
[Sun Jan 25 19:40:46 EST 2009] InvestorsLive right
[Sun Jan 25 19:40:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive BCS
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:01 EST 2009] InvestorsLive was good out of open
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:08 EST 2009] InvestorsLive $2.78
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:17 EST 2009] InvestorsLive had a dime stop .. but jumped over $2.80 level
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:21 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and was holding support there
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:38 EST 2009] InvestorsLive http://tinyurl.com/adg8re
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:38 EST 2009] randy841 something new live futures directly on BNN on all comps before only S&P
[Sun Jan 25 19:41:49 EST 2009] randy841 applies to cdn investors w/ BNN only
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:00 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_09:34:13 ] InvestorsLive BCS watching for reversal over $2.80 [Fri Jan 23_09:34:24 ] InvestorsLive if financials turn
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:10 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_10:03:32 ] InvestorsLive BCS trying… from sub 2.80, broke and trying
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:27 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_10:24:52 ] InvestorsLive BCS 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:30 EST 2009] InvestorsLive [Fri Jan 23_10:30:44 ] InvestorsLive BCS HODs
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:48 EST 2009] InvestorsLive it had gapped down -60-70 cents or so
[Sun Jan 25 19:42:50 EST 2009] randy841 hey IL …just back from the gymm … did u post the logs already?
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:01 EST 2009] InvestorsLive nope will shortly
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:04 EST 2009] randy841 ok … tx
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:08 EST 2009] NYCTrader01 are you guys making explicit calls to buy or sell a stock?
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:28 EST 2009] thahound anyone think TPX would make a good short for Monday, or still got some juice left in it?
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:42 EST 2009] InvestorsLive no NYC we don’t tell you what to do or give buy or sell recco’s .. I post what I do..
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I say when I am in or out, or take some off
[Sun Jan 25 19:43:52 EST 2009] InvestorsLive or short or long
[Sun Jan 25 19:44:17 EST 2009] pablo I have a question for the moderators
[Sun Jan 25 19:44:50 EST 2009] pablo Earlier this evening I had the opportunity to join a webinar about the market. It was facinating. The platform was go to meeting. Having audio was like night and day. I was wondering if you would consider trying this with trader’s chat?
[Sun Jan 25 19:45:11 EST 2009] pablo seminars
[Sun Jan 25 19:45:12 EST 2009] InvestorsLive no not with a traders chat pablo – but in future for seminar’s probably
[Sun Jan 25 19:45:43 EST 2009] pablo i don’t think it’s expensive
[Sun Jan 25 19:45:52 EST 2009] InvestorsLive TPX is unattractive to me thahound
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:02 EST 2009] pablo the seminars would be great
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:22 EST 2009] InvestorsLive It’s not about cost pablo – its about the most efficient way until we get onto regular topics and through most of the general knowledge and background stuff
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:39 EST 2009] InvestorsLive this gives a way for everyone be saved
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:43 EST 2009] Jasi So can we replay the recording
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive for a database and I can then go thru it all
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:56 EST 2009] mlbfan2007 So unfortunately I was called away from my computer on Friday and ended the day holding FAZ…where do you see this opening on Monday? Thanks IL!
[Sun Jan 25 19:46:58 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and put it into a format that means something
[Sun Jan 25 19:47:09 EST 2009] InvestorsLive no clue mlb
[Sun Jan 25 19:47:22 EST 2009] thahound IL, Is it because it might go for its previous resist of around 8-8.25?
[Sun Jan 25 19:47:44 EST 2009] InvestorsLive we just had a whole seminar about it mlb
[Sun Jan 25 19:47:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive where were u, ha
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:03 EST 2009] InvestorsLive thahound its a choppy chart
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:11 EST 2009] Laura we can’t predict the market. and we sure can’t predict FAS and FAZ
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:19 EST 2009] InvestorsLive nothing attractive… if its in play Monday and looks like an opportunity – maybe
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:25 EST 2009] thahound gotcha
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:40 EST 2009] thahound It is pretty choppy most of the time, eh
[Sun Jan 25 19:48:50 EST 2009] mlbfan2007 thanks Laura/IL!
[Sun Jan 25 19:49:25 EST 2009] pablo i must say, go to meeting rocks
[Sun Jan 25 19:49:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive its same thing as go to my pc pablo
[Sun Jan 25 19:49:58 EST 2009] InvestorsLive just branded with an audio feature
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:12 EST 2009] imexplosion i use gotomeeting for work…one downside is everyone would need to install the applet to participate
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:22 EST 2009] pablo no biggie
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:32 EST 2009] pablo takes about 2 seconda
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:40 EST 2009] Laura Okay guys, seminar finished for me. Night.
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:45 EST 2009] InvestorsLive anyhow – any others guys?
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:48 EST 2009] lighter I’m out too.
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:49 EST 2009] InvestorsLive I’m going to post logs
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:50 EST 2009] InvestorsLive in a sec
[Sun Jan 25 19:50:53 EST 2009] pablo yes
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:00 EST 2009] Blz See Laura, lighter
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:01 EST 2009] lighter Thanks for coming tonight everyone
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:04 EST 2009] Blz Thanks for the info
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:18 EST 2009] littercritter i have been in chat rooms with audio and it is distracting because you have people that want to to be “the bell of the ball”. i just want alerts, not to let people show off. i wan t make money.
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:22 EST 2009] pablo where is the best place to see the most up to date futures data
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:45 EST 2009] InvestorsLive agree litter
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:51 EST 2009] InvestorsLive whole point is to allow u guys to take the alert
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:54 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and know what to do with it
[Sun Jan 25 19:51:55 EST 2009] InvestorsLive eventually
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:01 EST 2009] thahound text is fine by me
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:01 EST 2009] InvestorsLive that’s the best thing u can take away
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:05 EST 2009] toefur learned lots tonight! thanks everyone
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:06 EST 2009] pablo i meant for seminars
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:19 EST 2009] InvestorsLive http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/stocks/futures.html
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:21 EST 2009] InvestorsLive pablo
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:22 EST 2009] thahound thought I knew plenty about ETFs, obviously not everything, thanks 🙂
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:34 EST 2009] Terri Thanks Tort, IL, Lighter…I learned some stuff I really didn’t understand about ETF’s
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:41 EST 2009] imexplosion but pablo, in the future they can take all of this and put it into a knowledgebase type format…cant do that with a gotomeeting recording
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:47 EST 2009] InvestorsLive we thought ETFs were important b/c many are trading them… and many don’t know about them
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:51 EST 2009] Terri ::wub
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:53 EST 2009] InvestorsLive what they are and why they are nutz
[Sun Jan 25 19:52:54 EST 2009] lighter Send IL any feedback/comments on seminar and we can incorporate into future sessions
[Sun Jan 25 19:53:02 EST 2009] thahound I never even realized the whole day-to-day aspect
[Sun Jan 25 19:53:09 EST 2009] thahound no wonder I lost my %%% overnight
[Sun Jan 25 19:53:27 EST 2009] thahound well, I didn’t lose my %%%, but I lost, and it sucked, especially after seeing about 15% gain AH
[Sun Jan 25 19:53:35 EST 2009] toefur what’s on the radar for next weeks seminar?
[Sun Jan 25 19:53:37 EST 2009] InvestorsLive Stock Fetcher scans will be updated in dashboard in the next day or 2
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:01 EST 2009] InvestorsLive toefur we were thinking of skipping next Sunday because of the SuperBowl.. and just keep it going in Feb
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:05 EST 2009] InvestorsLive what are your thoughts?
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:07 EST 2009] Chase Thanks Lighter/IL/Laura/Tort – good information!
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:12 EST 2009] InvestorsLive figured we’d have like 10 people in here
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:18 EST 2009] CABeachBum yeah, skip next week
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:27 EST 2009] InvestorsLive if you’re not watching the superbowl for football.. you’re watching it for the commercials..
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:28 EST 2009] imexplosion yes! go cards
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:40 EST 2009] pavtrader agreed
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:41 EST 2009] toefur do’h! forgot superbowl. good call!
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:48 EST 2009] thahound superbowl?
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:49 EST 2009] InvestorsLive so I will put that update out, also probably do some polls for topics
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:51 EST 2009] thahound meh
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:54 EST 2009] InvestorsLive and areas of confusion still
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:55 EST 2009] InvestorsLive etc
[Sun Jan 25 19:54:58 EST 2009] CABeachBum everyone should take the night off and root for a close superbowl (cards winning)
[Sun Jan 25 19:55:06 EST 2009] InvestorsLive go Pats!
[Sun Jan 25 19:55:13 EST 2009] imexplosion ha
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